Need advice on what to add to my stack or change it up

[Seymour Butts]

Hey everyone,
I haven’t posted in a while, but I lurk often.
I have been running a Test C, Deca, Dbol stack for a while. Actually over two years with some normal breaks. My last two cycles, I feel like I am getting nothing out of it anymore.
I train hard 5-6 days a week, I eat like crazy, but my diet is not spot on. I consume about 200-250 grams of protein a day from food and shakes, and I load up on carbs, including during my workout and post work out.
I am 50yo, 5ft9, 191lbs, and in the 12-15% Bf. I want to put on more size, even though this stack has worked great for me in the past, I just don’t see anymore gains from it.
I am doing 800mg of Test C a week, two pins in a week. 600mg of Deca a week, two pins a week, and 50mg of dbol ed.
I talked to a well known sponsor here, and he thinks my body has just become accustomed to it, and I should switch it up? I can buy that, but he recommended a test mix, or Sust250 in place of the Cyp. Now I could be wrong, but I thought Test is Test no matter what. He recommended staying with the Deca and Dbol. So know I’m confused with the whole test thing.
So my question is, do I change the test, or do I keep my current stack and add something to it, or do I bump up my current stack.

Please help, I am ready to start a new cycle, and looking for results again.

Thanks to all for any info you can provide.

 

[01dragonslayer]

I understand when you say 'test is test', with the exception of possibly suspension pre workout, when making gains. But if thats your philosophy what would it hurt to change it up. Have you considered adding some tren to the mix? Maybe some tren enth at 4-600mg/wk would IMO a definite difference. Just what your prolactin levels if you choose to do so.

 

[Muscle farmer]

I was thinking add in some tren as stated or maybe some trest ace.

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[Seymour Butts]

Thanks guys. I did ask the sponsor I was talking with about Tren, and said not for mass only cutting. I have read that people are using Tren E with a mass stack, and that's why I askes about it.

 

[Seymour Butts]

I am thiking maybe a Test mix and adding some Tren E. That was my original plan for this time around.

 

[Muscle farmer]

Thanks guys. I did ask the sponsor I was talking with about Tren, and said not for mass only cutting. I have read that people are using Tren E with a mass stack, and that's why I askes about it.

I've seen a few use tren for bulking but most can't eat properly. Look into some trest for a bulk man.

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[01dragonslayer]

Thanks guys. I did ask the sponsor I was talking with about Tren, and said not for mass only cutting. I have read that people are using Tren E with a mass stack, and that's why I askes about it.

IMO tren can compliment a bulk or a cut. Its really dependent on your cardio and dietary habits.

 

[1977_Corvette]

Maybe get some hcg and get off everything for awhile, or maybe just drop down to a trt dose of just test? If you want to stay on all year your gonna have to keep changing compounds a lot more often to keep gaining. At 50, I really think you should give your body a break for awhile, imo. How's your BP.

 

[Seymour Butts]

I do take breaks. I am not on indefinitely.

 

[1977_Corvette]

You are running almost 2 grams per week and weight at 191......that's low for that amount of juice, if you want more size I guess just up the gear and food, change up compounds and oral, what weight are you aiming for?

 

[Seymour Butts]

I would like to break 200.

 

[Seymour Butts]

I think I'm going to change it up some. Maybe the Test mix and up the Deca. Not sure about the Dbol yet.
So what is Trest?

 

[1977_Corvette]

If you got the cash, pick up some PharmaSwiss omnadren250 and run 1 amp m w f sun, then get some anadrol and maybe tren hex run 1cc m w f sun, you will blow past 200

 

[01dragonslayer]

Here are some good threads...

https://hardcore-underground.com/showthread.php/7240-Trest-ace-ment-!!?highlight=Trest+ace

https://hardcore-underground.com/showthread.php/7512-TREST-ACE-(MENT)-Review?highlight=Trest+ace

 

[01dragonslayer]

Profile....

Trestolone (Ment) Explained
by Mike Arnold

Trestolone ace, more popularly known as Ment, has developed quite a reputation over the last several years for being an exceedingly potent steroid. Combined with its initial long-term absence from the market, its current limited availability, and a market nearly devoid of high quality clones, its allure among steroid users has been further increased, taking on an almost super-drug status similar to what we saw when the now defunct Parabolan ceased production.

However, unlike most of the AAS which have hit the market in the last several years, Ment does not owe its popularity to enterprising OTC supplement companies or blackmarket dealers, but to legitimate medical research which has made its way into the BB’ing community. Ment was originally developed in the 1960’s, but recent interest has been generated by both the Population Council and the research-based pharmaceutical company Schering, due to their extensive investigation into Ment for the purposes of male birth control and hormone replacement therapy. This has resulted in some impressive findings, leading to the discovery of a steroid displaying a unique embodiment of traits, which are ideally suited to the muscle building process.

Belonging to the 19-nor family of steroids, Ment is more properly known as 7-alpha-methyl-nortestosterone, yet despite its close association to this class of steroids, Ment displays several characteristics more commonly attributed to Testosterone. Nowhere is this more evident than in the area of male sexual functioning. Anyone who has been around the steroid subculture long enough is aware that the 19-nor family of drugs is notorious for causing sexual dysfunction in males. Side effects such as low libido and/or the inability to obtain an erection characterize the use of steroids like Nandrolone or Trenbolone and led to the coining of terms such as “Deca-dick” and “Tren-dick”. While the humor inherent in such language is apparent, those who suffer with these self-inflicted maladies generally don’t find it a laughing matter.

This is where Ment differs. In fact, Ment is the only steroid in production today that is capable of sustaining normal male physiology in the complete absence of testosterone, including sexual functioning. This is one of the vital traits which has qualified Ment for consideration as a male contraceptive and hormone replacement therapy, as sexual dysfunction would be an unacceptable side effect in users seeking medical treatment for these reasons.

With regard to cycle set-up, the inclusion of Ment allows for the revision of one of its most basic tenants, which traditionally says that testosterone should be included in every cycle. Although I personally do not agree with that philosophy in all cases, there are many good reasons why Testosterone should generally be included in one’s cycle. However, Ment changes all that, making the inclusion of Testosterone optional and not a necessity. All the side effects which normally present themselves in a state of Testosterone deficiency are absent when Ment is employed. This is a big advantage unique to Ment alone and which enables an AASA user to think outside the box when designing his/her cycle.

Ment demonstrates a strong binding affinity for the AR receptor, being greater than that of Testosterone and even Nandrolone. Like Testosterone, it also has the ability to aromatize, making the concomitant use of an AI desirable in times of estrogen excess. As most AAS users are aware and which recent research confirms, estrogen plays a role in the muscle growth process both directly and indirectly, which is part of the reason why aromatizable steroids often impart superior mass gains compared to their non-aromatizing counterparts. So, while aromatization is beneficial in part, it can quickly be turned into a negative quality if not properly managed, resulting in side effects such as: gynecomastia, water retention, heightened blood pressure, increased HPTA suppression, mood swings, and the accumulation of additional bodyfat.

Other defining characteristics of Ment include a lack of DHT conversion and like most injectable preparations, Ment is also non-hepatotoxic in nature. In addition, Ment does not bind to sex hormone binding globulin (SHBG), increasing the potency of this drug considerably. When administering drugs such as testosterone, over 95% of the injected steroid ultimately ends up either attaching to SHBG, converting to DHT, or aromatizing into estrogen, leaving only a small amount of the original dose left for muscle building functions. Once a hormone attaches to the protein SHBG, it remains bound (in most cases) for the entire life of the steroid, rendering it completely useless. AAS which avoid SHBG binding allow a significantly greater percentage of the injected drug to reach its intended target at the androgen receptor and initiate the muscle growth process.

When determining Ment’s suitability as a prescription medication for male contraception or HRT, its effect on the prostate is of critical importance. This make or break factor was evaluated right from the start, with promising results. Research shows that Ment has a lesser effect on the prostate compared to testosterone per effective dose, reducing the potential risk of prostate issues in older men receiving treatment for HRT or otherwise. While younger users typically pay little heed to this aspect of their health, they may be glad they did later on down the road.

One area where Ment isn’t quite so friendly is that of HPTA suppression. Research shows that Ment is a full 12X as suppressive as Testosterone on a mg to mg basis. However, this side effect is deemed to be a necessary benefit when looking to develop this drug as a birth control medication. Any steroid used for birth control purposes requires an exceptionally high success rate at preventing pregnancy, and that will only come by way of significant suppression of spermatogenesis. In reality, most steroid users end up largely infertile by cycle’s end anyway, due to the number and quantity of AAS used.

Now let’s move onto the more exciting stuff; namely its ability to build muscle tissue. Most AAS users are primarily interested in one thing, which is…”How much muscle will this stuff really help me add?” While this question is impossible to answer, due to the numerous influential variables involved, we can look to both medical research and real-world experience to help provide us with a clearer picture of what to expect. The following quote is an excerpt taken from a study comparing the effects of Testosterone and Trestolone:

Study comparing Ment to Testosterone: “The ability of 7 alpha-methyl-19-nortestosterone acetate (MENT) to increase the weights of ventral prostate and seminal vesicles of castrated rats was four times higher than that of testosterone, while its effect on the weights of bulbocavernosus plus levator ani muscles (muscle), was 10 times that of testosterone.(Endocrinology. 1992 Jun;130(6):3677-83.)”

Referencing the paragraph above, we see that Ment delivers 10X the myotropic effect (muscle building) of testosterone, on a mg to mg basis. Based on these figures, this would make Ment more potent than any other non-toxic injectable currently sold on the market. I comparison to the exceedingly potent steroid Trenbolone, which is often used as a benchmark for potency, Ment outperforms it by a full 250%.

It is important to note that the results witnessed in this study were obtained by using primates as test subjects, so while it is likely that the results will translate pretty well to humans, there is no substitute for real-world human testing being conducted specifically for the purpose of performance enhancement. The overwhelming majority of our BB’ing knowledge, as it relates to the optimal application of PED for the purpose of muscle growths, was gained through the combined experience of generations of athletes. While quality versions of this steroid are scarce, enough individuals have experimented with this steroid at this point in time, for us to have a good idea of what to expect.

First of all, the BB’r should not expect to grow muscle at 10X the rate of Testosterone at an equivalent dose, but there is no doubt that one’s gains will measurably surpass what is attainable with an equal dose of Testosterone. Out of the few dozen people I have personally known who have used this steroid and based on the user experiences of others I am aware of, I would most aptly describe this steroid as a type of “super-testosterone”, in terms of results. Visually, the musculature tends to take on a similar appearance. This is not a great steroid for contest prep or achieving a hard & dry look, but if sheer bulk accompanied by some water retention is what you’re looking for, Ment will deliver. Like Testosterone, estrogen-induced water retention can be substantially reduced with the concurrent use of an AI, allowing a decently hard & dry appearance to manifest.

Even though Ment may behave similarly to Testosterone in terms of visual results & side effects, it is important to note that Ment’s ability to trigger these side effects at equivalent doses is much more exaggerated compared to testosterone. This is due largely to its increased androgenic potency. According to use feedback, Ment also carries with it the risk of developing certain “tren-like” sides in some users, especially at higher dosages, although not all users have reported this.

As far as dosing is concerned, no definitive guidelines have yet been formed, although in my opinion it is likely that Ment will probably end up being dosed along the same lines as Trenbolone, with the average dose falling somewhere 200-500 mg per week. Of course, not all users will adhere to these guidelines, with some electing to administer a more hearty dosage. Overall, we are looking at a very potent steroid, both on paper and in the real-world, which is capable of eliciting serious gains in mass & strength over a relatively short period of time. As availability increases, look for this steroid to take up a more permanent residence in the arsenals of BB’rs and strength athletes alike.

 

[Seymour Butts]

All you guys have been pretty helpful with this. I want to add Ment to my stack now.

 

[Muscle farmer]

All you guys have been pretty helpful with this. I want to add Ment to my stack now.

Check out D reds ment he has awesome stuff no pip and dosed correctly.

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[Seymour Butts]

So wait, Ment has to be pinned everyday?

 

[MotorCityMuscleMachine]

So wait, Ment has to be pinned everyday?

It's an acetate.., it can be pinned eod.. I don't see why not.

That's what I'm doing so as to proceed w/caution.

Pinned a full cc (50mg ) D-RED'S today, had started out with like 33 & only twice two days in a row. I'm setting on
50 eof for now 400 primo, 400+ Mast E low test 300-425 Total, nolva, Proviron, have been pinning low SD Suspension pre/WO, may keep it in there, not getting real lethargic on it maybe tired from odd long hours & the heat.., well see..?

May " eventually do Ed with the MENT, but back to 35 ish, access, then bump to 50 ED, b4 going any higher.

I like to taper with new addition's

 

[Seymour Butts]

It's an acetate.., it can be pinned eod.. I don't see why not.

That's what I'm doing so as to proceed w/caution.

Pinned a full cc (50mg ) D-RED'S today, had started out with like 33 & only twice two days in a row. I'm setting on
50 eof for now 400 primo, 400+ Mast E low test 300-425 Total, nolva, Proviron, have been pinning low SD Suspension pre/WO, may keep it in there, not getting real lethargic on it maybe tired from odd long hours & the heat.., well see..?

May " eventually do Ed with the MENT, but back to 35 ish, access, then bump to 50 ED, b4 going any higher.

I like to taper with new addition's

That sounds better for me. I have a hard time pinning twice a week already due to time, and keeping it hidden from the wife. Every day would be impossible for me. I wonder if I can start pinning it Monday’s and Friday’s, then eod? Either way, I want to give it a try.